Spain vs Portugal Bets

[addz123]

When was the last time they won a WC or have been in the finals?

In a group with Algeria, USA and slovenia, where would you expect them to come? 1st.

Second round = ghana or serbia.

Quarter finals = France, Mexico or Uruguay.


That was the supposed route england had at the beginning of the tournament. Hardly challenging to get to the semi's?

[Mr-AJ]

In a group with Algeria, USA and slovenia, where would you expect them to come? 1st.

Not really. Both US and Slovenia are strong teams with lot more team spirit than England. In my opinion England won't win anything within the next 12 years if they don't learn to focus more on the team than on individual stars. What will you do when Gerrard, Lampard, Terry, Ferdinand, etc. quit? They showed several times in the past that they might have the strongest team of individual players but their problems is they are not a team. I'm sorry that I had no expectations.

[addz123]

Not really. Both US and Slovenia are strong teams with lot more team spirit than England. In my opinion England won't win anything within the next 12 years if they don't learn to focus more on the team than on individual stars. What will you do when Gerrard, Lampard, Terry, Ferdinand, etc. quit? They showed several times in the past that they might have the strongest team of individual players but their problems is they are not a team. I'm sorry that I had no expectations.

This just shows u know nothing about football.

You're only making these claims based on hindsight and judgement following their exit.

Before the tournament started, England's expectations among everyone were very high. England played as a team throughout the qualifiers. They finished top of their group havn't won all but one of their games. They also happened to score more goals than anyone else, as a team, during qualifier.

I don't know why people say england don't play "as a team". Against germany they had more possession, more shots and more shots on target. They were let down by an unfit barry and a stubborn manager. Not to forget against germany the defense was dire (barry, upson and terry).

Every individual underperformed at the world cup, but i'm sick of people saying we don't play as "a team". imo it must have been player fitness and fatiguethat made england so bad. I've never seen any of those individuls play so badly.

[xYassassinYx]

Adam,

The main Germany players all played more games this season than the main England 'stars', so fitness really isn't an issue - not like they were in the Champions League final like some of the Germans.

Facts are England were absolutely pathetic in the two friendlies prior to the World Cup. They always fail on the big stages as a team.

The England team individually is one of the best in the world and yes they did well in the Qualifiers but really - so what? They qualified and that was to be expected from one of the top nations in the world.

Argentina just qualified and now look at them... playing great and team spirit is high, Maradona hugging the players after games, even when they are substituted etc.

3 weeks ago Capello was the 'best manager in the world' according to most England fans and media and now most people are calling for him to get axed in what a $6 million pay-off? - even calls for Beckham to be the next manager.

Such a joke.

They are all millionaires who didn't look like they even cared.

Only people I feel sorry for is the people who saved up for years to go watch them play like that - disgusting really, and fitness can't even be an excuse. They also had one of the best facilities in South Africa - £1,000 per night or something lol, come on.

Brazil all the way

[Mr-AJ]

Seems that you watched another game. We can agree to disagree. But you can try to explain why England's success seem to be centuries away although they always had great individual players. At least way better players than Germany and I guess you know Germany's success within the last 10 years.
And if you think I know nothing about football you should rise your horizon and listen to football discussions elsewhere than England. At least here in Germany you have not been a favourite at all. So please don't think your opinion is the only truth.

[TheGooner]

England overhyped? Yes they are overhyped but they still have a very strong team and everyone knew they were classic semi-finalists at minimum

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Classic semi-finalists at a minimum?!! Because they trounced mighty Kazakhatan (FIFA Rank 130) and demolished Andorra (192). No.

FFS - England have not reached a semi-final since Gazza's tears in 1990 - despite being hyped as potential winners by the home press for every event.

Repeating the same thing over and over and expecting different results is a type of madness and that's why I call the English World Cup team the "Great Delusion".

That's the same Spanish team that have won 47 of their last 52 games or something ridiculous like that? They are the best team and collective group of individuals to ever play in a major tournament imo..

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The difference between friendlies and qualifications and the finals are immense.

Yes Spain won all 10 qualifiers in their UEFA group. Well done. But do you know what the average FIFA rank of their opponents was? Guess. Go on. Then look at the next line.

The average FIFA rank in Spains group - excluding Spain - was seventy-two. Teams like Bosnia (57), Belgium (56), Estonia (119) and Armenia (110). These teams are lightweights and a win is the minimum.

Argentina have Messi and Tevez? omfg that means they'll win the world cup. In qualifiers they scored just one more goal than Bolivia and Ecuador, and the same as Venezuala. Messi scored 4 in 20 games, hardly golden boot quality..

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It might mean that they win the world cup yes. Certainly get the the quarter-finals which is more than many hyped European nations - France, Italy, Portugal ... and Engl ... OK I won;'t go there again.


Messi is not a striker - he's a creator. Huguain and Tevez have been given the scoring role.

The South American group is tough - the average FIFA rank of the 10 countries is just 40. Bolivia, Ecuador and Venzeula will run up big scores at home at altitude from time to time. But total goals doesn't decide qualifying spots - picking up points consistantly does.

Lastly that jubalani hype is not marketing hype. nearly every manager has complained about it.

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Now I've never seen a manager kick a ball?

And when they're asked to account for their teams poor performance - what do you think that they will say? Blame their team? Admit their own personal failings?? Hardly. The blam is shifted. Onto the match officials. The ground. The ball. The vuvuzeulas. The injuries. They all get the blame from losing managers.

Winning managers just shrug their shoulders, smile and get on with it.


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(BTW - Enjoying the debate)

[actyper]

Agreed. Germany's passing was crisp, England's was not. Their defence couldn't advance the ball at all, all their attempts ended with a turnover.

[addz123]

Adam,

So what if the germans played more games than us? Everyone knows the premier league has a way higher pace and tempo of football. It's one of the reasons it attracts so many players.

And the point about qualifiers, is that we played the same quality of teams as group stage. You can't explain thumping 5-1 wins in qualifiers against the backdrop of a 0-0 draw against algeria simply because 'we don't play as a team and we suck'. Obviously there is something else halting the team, and to me it looked like fitness.

Yassisin your historical analysis of england (being the same age as me) is wrong. Are we really a terrible team at big tournaments?

1990 we went out at penalties in the semi's - a lot of people were saying we would have gone on to win it had we not been eliminated.

1994...

1998 we went out at penalties again.

2002 eliminated by brazil, who went on to win the tournament.

2006 we went out again in penalties at quarter-finals.

2010 we absolutely sucked.

Capello is still one of the best managers in the world, 3 games doesn't change an entire career of success at madrid, milan and roma.

You think footballers don't care? You think they want to come home as losers and not win a world cup? ok..

carrager came out of int retirement to go to that world cup for gods sake! terry and ferdinand both cried when they were eliminiated last time round.

[xYassassinYx]

And the point about qualifiers, is that we played the same quality of teams as group stage. You can't explain thumping 5-1 wins in qualifiers against the backdrop of a 0-0 draw against algeria simply because 'we don't play as a team and we suck'. Obviously there is something else halting the team, and to me it looked like fitness.

Yassisin your historical analysis of england (being the same age as me) is wrong. Are we really a terrible team at big tournaments?


You think footballers don't care? You think they want to come home as losers and not win a world cup? ok..

We can agree to disagree but fitness is a lame excuse. These guy's train like crazy and had enough time to prepare and be recovered for the World Cup, and enough time between the games - they are professionals and train daily whether it be playing football on the training pitch or in the gym.

My historical analysis is wrong? Well I haven't saw them win anything in my lifetime.. maybe they should practice penalties more instead of driving their Ferrari's?

As for this line:

You think footballers don't care? You think they want to come home as losers and not win a world cup? ok..

All I can do is laugh. Come on man, where was the passion when they played every match? There was like a 15 minute spell in the Germany match after they scored and that was all....

No-one can honestly say England played with passion and like a team that were determined to win the World Cup.

Their tournament was a HUGE FAILURE and a total farce. Like I said, only people I feel sorry for are the fans who took out loans and saved up for years just to go watch England.

The England players will be back playing in the Premiership playing awesome individually and when it comes Euro 2012 time they will be hyped up yet again to win it, then falter again and then the same old excuses about being tired after playing in the Premiership all season will come out again and the manager will be in line to be sacked etc - same stuff gets boring after every tournament failure.

[addz123]

Response to Gooner's Spain Comment:

Winners of euro 2008 in which they beat germany. For the wc they had the addition of a few more emerging talents such as mata, busqets, martinez and navas.

It's impossible to argue with statistics if you're only going to count competitive matches because they hardly come around. euro 2008 they thrashed russia (4-1) then 3-0 in semi's, then they beat germny in final. I guess in run up to worl cup they beat italy england and chile but they were "friendlies".

Response to Gooners england qualifiers group comment:

OK we had an "easy group", having decimated croatia 5-1 and 4-1 away who are ranked 10th by fifa.